Danish Cartoon Affair: Letter from a Muslim

From the desk of Paul Belien on Sat, 2005-12-31 18:24

The Brussels Journal has been closely following the Danish cartoon affair. Unlike the meanstraim media, who (apart from Denmark) are not interested in the case, we think it is very important for the future of Europe. Today we received a long email from a Muslim reader explaining why he takes offence at two of the twelve cartoons (see them here) published last September in the Danish newspaper Jyllands-Posten. Islam prohibits depictions of the Muslim prophet Muhammad. When a Danish author complained that he could not find an artist to illustrate his book about Muhammad, the paper decided to ask Danish cartoonists to draw them pictures of the prophet. Our reader’s letter is published below. But first, the latest events in this ongoing case.

An influential Islamic organisation, the Islamic Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization (ISESCO), has called upon its 51 member states to boycott Denmark unless the Danish government “presents an official apology for the drawings that have offended the world’s Muslims.” Last Thursday, the foreign ministers of the 22 members of the Arab League also expressed their dissatisfaction with the Danish government. They demand that the Danish government change its attitude. So far Danish Prime Minister Anders Fogh Rasmussen has consistently refused to interfere, saying that his government has no power over what the media do.

Rasmussen has made it clear that people who feel that Jyllands-Posten has broken the law, should bring the matter to court instead of demanding media censorship from the government. According to Troels Lund, Rasmussen’s foreign affairs spokesman, the criticism of the Arab league will not make Copenhagen change its position. “It is important to stand our ground and say that we have a separation of powers in Denmark and something called freedom of expression,” Lund said.

Here is the letter of our Muslim reader, who lives in Canada:

Even in a democratic society with strong protections for freedom of speech and press, there are still limits that must be imposed. I have viewed all the cartoons and in terms of content, only two of them seem to me to be particulary problematic. Let me first say that I am a Muslim but I grew up and still live in North America, so I am accustomed to seeing newspaper cartoons that satirize every imaginable subject. Also, while there is a general prohibition among Muslims of graphically depicting the Prophet Muhammad (peace be on him) and the other Prophets, such as Moses, Abraham and Jesus (peace be on them), that prohibition has never been absolute and in certain periods there have been images of the Prophets, although their faces are either featureless or covered by a veil). Of course those pictures were made to illustrate religious texts, not to criticize the Prophets.

Personally, the simple artistic depiction of the Prophet Muhammad by a non-Muslim does not particulary bother me, any more than the depiction of Jesus or the other prophets in, for example Renaissance Art. The two cartoons that I personally find offensive are the ones that depict Muhammad as a knife-wielding terrorist and as wearing a turban that is in fact a bomb that bears the Islamic creed, “There is no divinity but God and Muhammad is his prophet”.

Of course, I have seen in my lifetime many editorial cartoons that I personally found to be offensive and almost all of them were about subjects far removed from Islam. A cartoonist has the right to draw and I have the right to be offended. Generally, nothing more needs to be said or done. However, as a society, we must take into account the sensibilities of others.

The Danish case is particularly interesting because the intention of the newspaper was to stir up controversy. The intention was to offend Muslims. The newspaper set out to provoke and they succeeded. It is strange that having succeeded they and their supporters are so incensed over the reaction. Contrast the Danish publisher’s approach with that of U.S. newspapers. In the U.S., freedom of speech and press is almost absolute. Even so, on a few occasions in recent years when an editorial cartoon has elicited a large critical outcry, in most cases, the newspaper has apologized to offended readers, pointing out that the intention of the artist was to express an opinion, that the freedom to express an opinion is guaranteed and must be protected but that in hindsight it is apparent that the same message could have been conveyed without unnecessarily insulting a significant number of readers.

In your article, you refer to Madame Louise Arbour, the U.N. High Commissioner for Human Rights, who is quoted as saying the cartoons were “an unacceptable disrespect”. Madame Arbour is a Canadian and she was for many years a respected judge in Canada. It is likely that her opinion in this matter is coloured by her experience as a Canadian jurist. Here in Canada, we have for many years had to reconcile a VERY multi-cultural society with our constitutional protections on freedom of speech and press. As a result, our basic freedoms are not absolute. We have a constitutional principal that basic rights are “subject only to such reasonable limits prescribed by law as can be demonstrably justified in a free and democratic society.”

Two of those reasonable limitations concern “blasphemous libel” and “hate propaganda”. The criminal statute outlawing hate propaganda bars the WILLFUL promotion of hatred, which is defined as “communicating statements, other than in private conversation, wilfully promotes hatred against any identifiable group.” The law allows for certain defences. A person cannot, for example, be convicted “if he establishes that the statements communicated were true” or “if the statements were relevant to any subject of public interest, the discussion of which was for the public benefit [thus unlikely to cause public disorder], and if on reasonable grounds he believed them to be true.” Furthermore, no conviction can be obtained if the statement was to express in good faith an opinon on a religious matter, UNLESS that expression contravenes the blasphemous libel statute.

The blasphemous libel statute has rarely been used in Canada, but it remains in full force and effect. Under it, people can still argue against and criticize religious beliefs and persons but only with tact and circumspection. The statute says that “No person shall be convicted of an offence under this section for expressing in good faith and in decent language, or attempting to establish by argument used in good faith and conveyed in decent language, an opinion on a religious subject.”

What I am trying to point out here is that in Canadian law, our Parliament has protected freedom of speech on the one hand and sought, on the other hand, to limit any disruption of the social fabric by outlawing speech that is so intemperate that it could lead to public disorder or violence.

Of course, another aspect of the Danish affair is that the cartoons were not published in a vacuum. They were published against the backdrop of widespread anti-Muslim prejudice and of incendiary statements likely to provoke hate against Muslims in Denmark. The decision to publish them came only a few months after Her Majesty Queen Margrethe II of Denmark was quoted in the London Telegraph as saying: “We have to show our opposition to Islam and we have to, at times, run the risk of having unflattering labels placed on us because there are some things for which we should display no tolerance.”

The Queen of Denmark (who is also titular Head of the State Lutheran Chruch) has called on her subjects to oppose Islam and to display intolerance even in the face of public criticism. (She obviously is unaware of the respectful position of most Christian churches, including her own, on Islam). If Her Majesty Elizabeth II, the Queen of Canada (or her Governor General) ever said such words, there would be a constitutional crisis and calls for the Sovereign herself to be charged with inciting race hatred under the Canada Criminal Code.

In a recent private letter to me, a Danish Lutheran theologian and social activist, had, in part, this to say:

“We are facing a difficult time in Denmark right now. Many people and consequently also many politicians are worried and afraid of the presence of Muslims in Denmark. We have about 4 % of the population which is Muslim today. In the 90s the rightist populist party ‘Dansk Folekparti’ (Danish People's Party) campaigned against the Muslims and other immigrants, but after 9-11 (2001) other parties joined in the chorus and at the election in November 2001 it was the main theme. The press from the beginning added fuel to the fire by focusing almost entirely on the problems with Muslims/immigrants and has presented social issues involving immigrants from a religious/Muslim angle. Finally our dear Queen has joined the populist chorus by her very problematic statements concerning some of her subjects, the Muslims!

(...) A number of individual members of the Lutheran church, including pastors and sometimes also bishops (and my humble self), have again and again spoken up against this campaign against Muslims. (...)

Nine of the ten dioceses in the Lutheran Church in Denmark have set up an organization called ‘Folkekirke og Religionsmøde’ (Folk church and Religious Encounter, or Church and Dialogue). I was the chairman for this organization for the first 3 years and we have worked to create a positive awareness among congregations concerning their Muslim neighbours. We have established a national dialogue forum with leaders of Muslim groups, and we are publishing materials to educate the congregations.”

Those, like yourself, who speak out in favour of freedom of speech and press should also speak out against the raising tide in Denmark of racial and religious intolerance. The Danish cartoon affair is NOT just a test of basic freedoms, it is a concerted attack on a visible minority and that attack is being waged not only by incendiary cartoonists but also by government officials included the Queen of Denmark herself.

 

Meanwhile in Sweden a jeans manufacturer, Bjorn Atldax, has designed a jeans brand with an anti-Christian logo: a skull with a cross turned upside down on its forehead. “It is an active statement against Christianity,” Atldax told The Associated Press. “I have a great dislike for organized religion.” He says he wants to make young people question Christianity, which he calls a “force of evil.” He added that he has plans “to make something anti-Hindu because I think its caste system is awful.” But he is not considering any anti-Islamic designs because “there are already a lot of anti-Islamic sentiments.”

As a Caribbean blogger observes: “By his willingness to offend Christians and Hindus, and his hands off attitude to Islam, Atldax is proving himself to be very European.” We trust that the UN’s Louise Ardour, the EU’s Franco Frattini and the Council of Europe will respond in the same way to Bjorn Atldax’s jeans as to Jyllands-Posten’s cartoons, and demand that the Swedish government take the same actions as they want the Danish government to take. Or will they, too, prove themselves to be “very European”?

dear sister nermin

Submitted by bashar on Mon, 2006-02-06 04:10.

thanks for the advise your are right they do not know that is what our prophit said if they know what a beatifull religion we ahev they will begging god for forgivness i will stop repsonding them with the same tone keep your well written messages becuase i know for a fact it will sound in their mind even if they deny it allh yehimiki and allah akabar at this point i am iranian i am everymuslims and i wish iran well with their nuclear program and we have to keep the boycott....one things resume of this show how some and few people are ignorant about the fact of religion and other culture knowingthat not everyone is like them not every christian and jew are like these gentelmen.....
and i rrespond with the same tone sometimes for god saying treat them teh way they treat you..
but i will change my way of writing to well organized messeges

Congratulations

Submitted by Slim shady on Sat, 2006-02-04 18:45.

Congratulations to Nermin and all "peaceloving" Mulims. So now you've burned our embassy in Damaskus down, while the Syrian authorities did nothing. You have no honour, you have no compassion, you are a disgrace to human kind.
Please everybody, who disagrees with Nermin and her proganda, boycott her. You cannot discuss or try to explain anything to a fundamentalist.

to this done

Submitted by nermin on Sat, 2006-02-04 19:21.

hhahh,you really made me laugh .where is the freedom of speech you claim to defend .
if you want your embassies not to be burnt together with your flags,you should have respected over one fifth of the population Mr whatever.
if you insult someone in the street ,noone will blame this if he reply to you rudeness.
i feel pity for you for you r ignorance and double standards you look at anything in life.
can your damned news paper dare to make cartoons mocking gays...
of course not because no one dare but you dared to mock a prophet of 1.5 billion muslism who himself didnot do anything to you but what can i say .it is your ignorance and foolishness.

Well, I'm really glad I made

Submitted by Slim shady on Sat, 2006-02-04 19:51.

Well, I'm really glad I made you laugh, Nermin. I must say I'm rather surprised, because I didn't think that was possible for you.
I don't see the double standard, though. Burning our flag is something you're free to do. I mean, nobody gets hurt and it's a perfect way of showing how you feel about Jyllandsposten (even though Jyllandsposten doesn't represent the Danish people, nor the Government, but that is apparently impossible to explain a fundamentalistic Muslim, so I won't try anymore).
Burning down buildings, in which people live and work, is pure violence and nothing else. Can't we agree on that at least?
It's funny, you keep talking about wanting to protect the prophet Muhammad, but you're so different from what he stood for. I'm sorry Nermin, but I don't think he would have liked you and all your hatred.

to this done

Submitted by nermin on Sat, 2006-02-04 19:19.

hhahh,you really made me laugh .where is the freedom of speech you claim to defend .
if you want your embassies not to be burnt together with your flags,you should have respected over one fifth of the population Mr whatever.
i feel pity for you for you r ignorance and double standards you look at anything in life.
can your damned news paper dare to make cartoons mocking gays...
of course not because no one dare but you dared to mock a prophet of 1.5 billion muslism who himself didnot do anything to you but what can i say .it is your ignorance and foolishness.

Islamic Responsibility

Submitted by DuaneF on Sat, 2006-02-04 17:12.

Nermin,

We have one point of agreement - JustinOK seems to be as full of hate as the people he criticizes. He has several good points but they are mostly lost in visceral rhetoric. After that I would have to say that you are as misled as anyone on this site.

Islam as a peaceful religion? I suppose that there is a lot of peace taught in the Quaran and I believe that most Muslims are peace loving people who want the same as I do. It is also true, however, that the Prophet slaughtered an entire tribe of Jews near Medina before he Conquered Mecca - without a fight because of his demonstration of ruthlessness. It is also true that most of the terrorists currently active in the world proclaim a bastardization of Islam.

A lot of regular Muslims have called for the death of Danish cartoonists in some sort of Islamic Justice because they have "blasphemed" Islam. These are the same people who would blaspheme Christianity's central tenet of the Trinity without trying for a moment to understand it. This is the same people who descrated the most sacred place in Judaism - the Temple Mount - by building a mosque over it. Read what the Bible and see what God (Yahweh) thinks of other religions building altars on his sacred sites. This is the same people who similarly descrated Hindu temples in India by building mosques over their levelled foundations. Muslims have nothing to say about others "blaspheming" their faith.

With respect to World War II, have you ever heard of Haj Amin al-Husseini? He was the Grand Muffi of Jerusalem. He spent much of the war in Berlin as an honoured guest of the Third Reich where he had a significant part in the development of the "Final Solution" - all for the right of Palestinian Muslims to take care of the "Jewish Problem" in Palestine themselves. He developed Palestinian Nazi units for the Balkans and the Yugoslavs wanted him prosecuted for war crimes after the war but, because of his immense popularity in the Middle East they were denied. Middle Eastern Muslims were significant collaborators and partners in the Holocost and, as such, bear as much responsibility for their history as anyone in Europe.

The Holocost was not a European event separate and apart from a peaceful world of the Prophet. It is time that Islamic apologists own up to that and quit spouting lies that place themselves on a pedestal they don't deserve. Only after that - not the abandonment of Israel by the West - will there be a peaceful co-existance. I am not, however, holding my breath waiting for this mass weaning of from the addiction to self-righteousness.

to patriotii

Submitted by Aman on Wed, 2006-02-08 21:12.

you will not be happy by the end of the crusades
Read the history again

reply to nermin

Submitted by JustinOK on Sat, 2006-02-04 12:52.

you say that dispalys of anger as in burnings are done all over the world...we these are meant to strike an insult to the relative people, just like the cartoon, but if you burn a dummy or a flag no one declares war and demands the severed heads of those responsable. And those representations of real people where the cartoon is of a unproven(and in my opinion fictious)prophet.

But you are right about one thing. Muslims will never be red indians. Red indians had honor and heritage, muslims are a violent, hate driven plague on the earth

to JustinOK from nermin, no one logic sentence

Submitted by nermin on Sat, 2006-02-04 13:23.

you did not reply with one logic sentence mr...
only ugly words.
i said that in my past comments but i have to say here again.clinton burnt his own flag one day..
if you donot believe in any prophets .it is up to you..none said to you otherwise but dont impose that on others and dont mock other.
the prophet to muslims is not a piece of cloth burnt everyday to protest and not a damn dummi of any politician who comes and go ....
even celebrities have problems with the press so donot be ignorant to that extent

TO ALL ANGRY MUSLIMS

Submitted by Brian on Sat, 2006-02-04 12:11.

I heard some Islamic nutbag wrote here that all muslims that were angry at the freedom in the west to mock ANY RELIGION would move back to Ilamic countries if westerners would get out of the middle east.

DEAL!!!

I'm sure we could work something out! There are NO westerners in their right minds who would choose to live in countries like that, so it would be the US
and UK soldiers and western oil companies.

All of us want our soldiers back. They want to come home. As soon as new elections are over in the US and UK, the new governments will bring back the soldiers.

That will be easy to solve, as nobody here wants them in the Middle Esatern psycho ward that muslims call countries.

And all the western oil companies... the same people who came up with the technology to FIND the oil, to PUMP it out of the ground, to DISTRIBUTE the
oil... in other words invented and built the whole petro industry for you, and payed your depotic leaders billions and billions of dollars so that they could lay around the French Riviera and fuck 50,000$ a night whores and bet 5,000,000$ a night on baccarat, send their children to expensive western schools, WHILE THEY GIVE THEIR OWN PEOPLE NOTHING.

The worst leaders in the world history have made themselves billionaires many times over and kept their people in poverty and sickness. Instead, the give the
people ISLAM. Why is it that Islamic countries have such vast wealth in oil and the only people who profit from it is your two faced, lying leaders wh make deals with the west and keep all the money for themselves. So we get the western companies out and we buy your oil at whatever price you want, because lets see you EAT and DRINK oil.

Then everybody is happy. You are where you want to be, and we don't have to listen to you "DEMNAD" how we act in our own counttries. You won't have to threaten us with your big, bad Muhjahadeen fighters.

Your fighters are such cowards... they are REALLY GOOD at attcking WEDDING RECEPTIONS, SCHOOL BUSES, OFFICE BUILDINGS WITH HIJACKED JETS, CAFES, HOTELS and all soft, undefended targets. Every single time we get you on a battlefield we kick your ass and you turn and run like cowards.

Only in Afghanistan against the Russian army were you successful, ONLY BECAUSE THE CIA gave you weapons and training. How else would shoot down a Russian helicopter? Chase it on your camel and throw rocks at it? No, THE CIA gave you Stinger missles,
technology that you NEVER are able to come up with on your own because you are kept in such IGNORANCE by your depotic, criminal leaders that the only way you can get an education in the fields of science required to make weapons like that is if you try to get out (again) of your own pitiful countries and go to school in the West.

And if you think Iran or Pakistan can help you with their little pathetic nuclear programs... we have dozens and dozens submarines under all the oceans of the world, and JUST ONE of them could take out ALL YOUR CAPITAL CITIES AND THE PEOPLE IN THEM
IN TWENTY MINUTES.

So go ahead and try to start something. You may kill some of us, but 20 minutes later you will ALL be extinct. 

 

To Brian

Submitted by Aman on Wed, 2006-02-08 21:10.

you said: "There are NO westerners in their right minds who would choose to live in countries like that"
You are absolutely wrong, there are thousands of americans and europeans who live in the gulf states, believe me: they kiss the sandy land under the feet of Saudis, for some Saudi Riyals.

you said: "There are NO

Submitted by Aman on Wed, 2006-02-08 21:09.

you said: "There are NO westerners in their right minds who would choose to live in countries like that"
You are absolutely wrong, there are thousands of americans and europeans who live in the gulf states, believe me: they kiss the sandy land under the feet of Saudis, for some Saudi Riyals.

ask those people too

Submitted by nermin on Wed, 2006-02-08 21:24.

there are also a lot of tehm who spend their vacation in dubai.ask ex presidend clintion and madonna who have houses there .aslo ask brad bit and anglina jolie and mickel jackson about their vacation recently there.
aslo u can ask tony blair about his spending for teh third consecutive years his chrismas vacation in sharm elsheikh in egypt.
donot make hatred and blindness drive u from your senses .

why anyone make mocking cartoons

Submitted by nermin on Sat, 2006-02-04 11:57.

If we want to make cartoons to mock..there are a lot of things to mock about in this world. Is not that true…we can even mock those who eat donkeys and insects which are disgusting …what about Indians women give dowry to Indian men..what about Indian wives who were buried alive with her dead husbands. what about those who drink blood to give them  power for life as they claim …

 

If I am about to mention examples ,I will not finish..

 

But why I mock other human living with me in this universe. why I donot live in peace and in my own business and let others live too….

 

Why I donot give my concern to my own concern and my own problems

 

Why I make awful things then cover it with freedom of speech which is  a rubbery word….what I will gain from provoking other humans living with me in the same planet..

 

For the million of times,making cartoons criticizing or making fun of any politician or leader to attract the attention of eth society to the attitudes or action of that person who are supposed to work for the society is allowed and welcomed but interfering  even in personal life of  people or celebrities is not welcomed because it may hurt or destroy their life…

Can anyone reply tome giving me his or her opinions ..looking forwards reply from you .

 

N.B . I am not against Indian, as they are great ancient nation.

 

 

 

reply

Submitted by JustinOK on Sat, 2006-02-04 12:15.

I guess what you're saying is everyone should just get along and mind their own business...thats funny I thought thats what the people who died on 9/11 were doing, what about all the bus bombings, market bombings, ect. is that what you call living in peace with your fellow man.

And you talk about mocking if it is so bad to mock people then why don't you tell all the people in the middle east who burn dummies resembling pres. Bush and other leaders around the world that they are adversely affecting the well being of humanity and see what kinda of response you get from them

to JustinOK from nermin

Submitted by nermin on Sat, 2006-02-04 12:38.

You are totally unaware of what you say…
Burning piece of cloth which is the flag of any country or dummi of any any politicians is something done wordwide by all nation and ethnics groups .right or wrong. Fighting an d defending are also normal attitudes of aggression and occupying…but you fool arrogant want tokill others and humiliate an doccupy without any loss..
The arabs or Palestinians are not and will never be the red indians.
Ignoring fact will never lead to anywhere.
Withdraw from iraq and afghansatan , stop supporting Israel. or you are Israeli yourself. And you will live in peace as you were living only 10 years ago…..

Response to threats from weak people

Submitted by JustinOK on Sat, 2006-02-04 11:51.

First of all to the kitten comment.  In the USA we know how to deal with animals who attack humans. You put them down with the bad end of a rifle.

To those who say muslims are victims in a hate filled world.  You all make me sick, you poor bastards think blowing yourselves up in the name of your god will bring you great rewards...then why don't you all follow suit so the world can be rid of you freaks(and you not freaks for your religous choices, it's your life choices)

And to the rest of you who talk of bringing war, GO AHEAD AND TRY!!!

The whole world say what the US did to you in such a short time.  What do you think will happen if you bring war and actually invade someone?  I'll tell you, the USA and the rest of the world will bend you poor, delusional, sub-human, pieces of shit over, and shove you precious Jihad up your turbin topped asses!

So in closing, if you can't live without trying to blow everyone up, then you don't deserve to live.  

my dear fellow justin

Submitted by bashar on Mon, 2006-02-06 04:20.

win first the war in irak the count of american tools is 2567 after the invasion
win that war and then conquer teh islamic world and countries with all teh things in them
sweet dream
lastest new 4 marines just dies in irak today

bonsey

Submitted by American Liberal on Sat, 2006-02-04 07:05.

That was very funny about stealing resources!  Hopefully in the near future, with methane , hydrogen and wind sources all the oil wells will be capped.

Limits on Free Speech

Submitted by DuaneF on Sat, 2006-02-04 05:59.

As a Canadian I embrace the limits on free speech when they prevent incitements to violence, particularly against identifiable groups (hate literature). I will, if necessary, give my life for the freedom in my country to free speech that simply offends. I am offended daily by extremist Muslim rhetoric against the West (now including Denmark) and Israel. I am offended by the common Muslim mocking of the Christian belief in the Holy Trinity and the desecration of the Temple Mount by Islam. I, however, live in a secular society - as do Muslims outside of the Middle East.

If I want to live somewhere where such blasphemies against Christianity and Judaism are crimes I must go and live there (I don't know where that would be if I wanted to go there). Muslims who want to live somewhere where blasphemies against the Prophet are crimes they can to to the Islamist Middle East. Otherwise they can buck up and fuck off.

Islam

Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Thu, 2006-02-02 22:16.

Islam is truly a violent and evil religion and the reaction of the Muslims only proves the point.

lets use freedom of speech for some good instead of provoking

Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Thu, 2006-02-02 18:06.

first off, i am a muslim as well and i agree that threats to kill the author are completely wrong. Killing doesn't justify anything. it must be understood that just because some people have posed a threat to kill the author doesn't mean that its a muslim point of view. Those are radical people's point of view, not radical MUSLIMS. Everyone says there should be absolutely no limit to freedom of speech but think about it, everything good has to have a limit. Too much of a good thing is never good. You will never give a child infinite amounts of candy because it will make them sick. Think of anything good that you would enjoy....and then imagine endless amounts of it....it would eventually hurt you in maybe a small amount or a very large amount but it would hurt you, right?
In countries like USA, under the freedom of speech, if you verbally threaten someone, you will be imprisoned. Therefore, we have alredy imposed a limit on the freedom of speech because it would be hurting someone. By drawing cartoons of our prophet, they are hurting our prophet. Just because one does not believe in someone else's religion does not mean they can disrespect the beliefs of others. Is this not also the basis of democracy? That you may express your opinions and beliefs and follow them as long as you do not harm yourself or others. You may disagree with other beliefs and say why you disagree but you should not do so by ridiculing and insulting.

The reason Muslims across the world uproared to the cartoons is that they value prophets (ALL OF THEM). Other than the crazy osama and people who believe in terrorizing and kidnapping all the time, muslims respect all religions. We have otherwise not shown hostility to others. The only people who did so were osama and his followers. Other than that, muslims are just regular people wanting everyone to leave them alone and let them practice their religion. In the midst of all this post 911 stuff and constantly having their religion debated, posting such cartoons further insults and ridicules and hurts the rights of millions of muslims to practice their religion. The freedom of speech was put in place to be able to express opinions. Could the authors not have done so without drawing pictures of Mohammed (P.B.U.H) face thereby expressing their opinions without disrespecting other religons?I'm sure he could have. He would have expressed his opinion and nobody would have said anything.
Another might argue that well then again we are limiting ourselves. I would say but why not limit yourself? what's wrong with limiting yourself? does it hurt anyone? NO! isnt that how the world should go on? are we supposed to be trying to hurt others all day not just with weapons and war but now with words as well? Forgetting religions and beliefs, what are we basing our words and ways of life on if we just go on saying what we want not caring what happens to others?
Generally, societies follow the moral of reciprocity. If today you ridicule one religion, tomorrow they will ridicule you and it will keep on going and going but where would we get? because in the end there will still be people on both sides of the argument. It doesn't matter whether it is Islam vs. another religion. It could be any two religions. This isn't a fact or theory that we can solve through science or math. It is a matter of beliefs. If the author has the right to speech then so do muslims to practice their religion without insults and ridiciule day and night on the media and in their faces.

There are millions of cartoons and articles and books out there right now expressing opposing views to Islam and to our prophet and each has been returned equally with arguments in cartoons, articles, scientific articles, etc. Drawing a picture of his face was far more than an opinion or opposing argument. Drawing a picture of our prophets face was just plain disrespect. Muslims are fighting today for the respect of their religion. Osama and his followers are like the bullies you have in school when you are little. If you ignore them, they will die down and go away but the more you try and match up to them the worse they will get. So, when authors and cartoonists made millions of pictures and wrote articles ridiculing and insulting Osama, only his followers that are affected directly were the ones who revolted. Otherwise the rest of the sane true Muslim world agreed that osama is wrong and should be imprisoned and punished.

These cartoons are only insulting Islam because of Osama and 911 and all that, I would like to know how much the authors know about Islam to think up of that message? Did they actually pick up a Quran and compare numerous history books and articles to find out if that is what our prophet was like or did they just base it on Osama's interpretation? If I learn that they really did do thorough research on Islam and our prophet and their opinion remained unchanged, I would commend them for their unbiased opinions BUT still would go against them because they drew the face of our prophet. I respect their opinion no matter what it is and so do other muslims butttt all we want is for others to respect ours and not ridicule it. Others have the right not to believe in it and disagree with Islam but they do not have the right to make a joke of it. If Islam is being made a joke then so must be every other religion in the world and once we do that...what else is left to do? Can't religions, beliefs and values be left alone since they are supposed to be separate from politics? (i.e. separation of church and state)
If the authors did not do any research and based it on stereotypes and Osama's ideas of jihad, then it is an ignorant opinion BUT an OPINION nonethelss that he DOES HAVE THE RIGHT TO EXPRESS. HOWEVER, and i have said this again and again DRAWING THE FACE of the prophet was what was wrong.
Suppose relations between person A and person B are very hostile. Person A learns that a certain comment would provoke person B to become very very angry and person A then actually makes that comment, person B then reacts by using foul language and after some time of arguing person B's temper explodes and he starts to fight physically. Who's fault is it? Suppose person A and B were your children. Ofcourse you would yell at both kids. Person A was wrong because he provoked knowing that person B would react and be upset. Person B was wrong because he did not control his temper. But if person A had never said anything....nothing woud have happened right? Both sides would have stayed apart and minded their own business.
In sum, freedom of speech is a great thing butttt it should be used wisely.....heres a thought....let's use it to cause good and happiness for mankind instead of disruption, political unrest and unhappy people all over the world? we already have world hunger, aids, global warming and other huge problems.....why not make a cartoon that makes fun of rich people spending money on diamond encrusted eyelashes instead of donating to unicef?

Anti-Religiousness. Period.

Submitted by Samoth (not verified) on Wed, 2006-02-01 22:14.

In regards to Bjorn, producing pop culture artifacts that desecrate Christianity... who cares (that is among the Westerners)?! But probably according to the Muslim world, this is exactly where we've gone wrong, as the 'INFIDELS' THAT WE ARE... "Nothing is sacred to us... oh no... guess, maybe because we don't believe in the Quaran, but instead, practice Democracy, Capitalism and HUMAN RIGHTS?"

Try doing just that, imagine being a Muslim man of origin, who decides to express HIS DIFFERENCE OF OPINIONS AND EXPRESS HIS HUMAN RIGHTS, producing such artifacts that desecrate Islam in one of the Muslim countries...

A similar situation could never be imagined to be happening in the Muslim world because if one decides to express his / her difference in views of the matter, he / she will immidiately be shut down and killed, no questions asked. But of course, in the 'precious' religion of Islam NOTHING CAN BE QUESTIONED. Look at the fate of Salman Rushdie... and the fact that every Muslim is vowed to kill him on the spot, if found.

And speaking of the word 'PRECIOUS': seems like someone here, or maybe it's the collective Muslim world, have reached a stage similar to that of the Golum (of the Lord of the Rings), whenever they refer and think of Islam.

"Oh!! My Prreciousssssssss!!!"

"The Danish cartoon affair

Submitted by BenFranklin (not verified) on Wed, 2006-02-01 21:56.

"The Danish cartoon affair is NOT just a test of basic freedoms, it is a concerted attack on a visible minority"

But let us ignore the beheading of Christian girls in Indonesia, the bombing of churches in Pakistan and the jailing of Zoroastrians in Iran.

Some others wish to talk about the great tolerance which is Islam, tolerance which can be obtained only through dhimmi status and your payment of jizya. Talk about you institutionalized attack on a minority. But even this still doesn't really protect you from the Muslim mob because if they want what you have then all bets are off.

Some others mentioned the Coptic Church and conversion...what happens to would be converts from Islam, oh thats right Apostates are to be killed.

The most interesting fact is the overwhelming tolerance given to muslims from the West, even to those muslims who want to destroy it. Yet cartoons are such a provacation that danes are beaten in Gaza...tell me what is the bigger crime the cartoons or the assualt. It seems that the assualt was warranted due to the cartoons...even if those assualted had nothing to do with them. Where is the moderate tolerant muslim's rage over such injustice. No where to be found.

Islam - terror or religion?

Submitted by Jozef (not verified) on Thu, 2006-02-02 01:47.

I agree with you, using violence is not the way to express one's anger. Islam appears to justify everything in accordance to their belief. We in Europe should wake up and realise that unless we encourage moderate Islam we will experience Islamic Fundamentalist who will destroy us. And one more thing, freedom of speech is one of the main tenets of our freedom so let's protect it.

Help for repatriation to Sharia Law states for unhappy Moslems

Submitted by Vin atmop (not verified) on Thu, 2006-02-02 01:56.

I think it's unfair that those who wish to live under Sharia law have to live in secular Europe. All European states should start schemes to help these people to move to Sharia Law states as they must wish. We could all contribute to this repatriation fund for Moslems who don't like European laws and moral and ethical standards.
Vin

to vin atomp

Submitted by bashar on Sat, 2006-02-04 07:51.

stop buying muslim oil......for good....and send all muslims where ever you want..

Islam - terror or religion?

Submitted by Jozef (not verified) on Thu, 2006-02-02 02:01.

Yeah, thats a good idea. Anyone who suffers under European democratic laws and wishes to live under sharia please leave now. However, if anyone wishes to stay and live under European democratic laws please stay and enjoy!
So our muslim friends you have only two choices.

Get out of Muslim Countries First

Submitted by Aman on Thu, 2006-02-02 03:05.

These pages shows how tolerant are the Europeans?
They believe that they are right, and so; everybody else is bad and wrong!!
You ask the Muslims to leave your Europe, ok but first stop steeling our resources, get out of our countries, what are you doing in Iraq ? in Afghanistan?
Europeans and Westerns have done horrible things not only to Muslims but to the whole Human race; USA has killed hundreds of thousands of civilians in Japan with the nuclear bombs, they have killed millions in World wars 1 & 2 , and used the poor people of Africa and Asia as fuel for their dirty wars.
So , in comparison ; Your elected governments have killed more than 30 Million man and woman during the last century, while you blame Islam for some individuals behavior.
Islam is against the killing of civilians, but the explosions in NY, London , Madrid are just the reaction of your attacks on Muslims.
I wish that this attacks will stop because I'm against the killing of civilians whatever their religion is , but the Europeans want to live secure in their country while killing others outside!!!
At the same time I fully support the Iraqi and the Afghani resistance which target the American and the western occupiers. And by the way the Danish soldiers in Iraq are now hiding like mice in their bases, Strange Danes, so brave in Denmark, cowards in Iraq
For that American who serves in Iraq, get out before you return to your country in a box. Your nothing but a contributor in the killing of the Iraqis. Shame on you?

Stealing resources?

Submitted by Bonesy on Sat, 2006-02-04 06:31.

Last time I checked, I was paying through the nose for the pleasure of "stealing" your resources. I think I speak for all Americans when I offer you and anyone else an open invitation to "steal" any and all of our resources.

A few things

Submitted by Bonesy on Sat, 2006-02-04 06:21.

I'm not totally directing this at you Aman, but you made mention of the Japan issue that needs a little clarification. It's easy and certainly simplistic as an outsider to condemn the use of atomic weapons in WWII. In fact, almost any non-American that I have ever spoken with feels as you do about it. But the truth is that the US had engaged Japan in a VERY bitter struggle throughout the Pacific for 3 1/2 long years. During the island hopping campaign that ulimately led to Japan's doorstep, the losses on both sides were horrific. Some of these islands were extremely small yet the casualties were in the tens of thousands. The Americans had no illusions about what they would face in an all out invasion of the Japan mainland. I'm not saying whether I feel it was right or wrong. The point is that it is very difficult to make judgements about the past without having lived through it.

You make some interesting points in general but where is Islam's blame? Muslims kill plenty of Muslims. They are no different than any other race. When Americans kill Muslims the whole Arab world goes mad, but when Hindus do it, not a word to be heard. When Pakistan goes at it with India, do you see other Muslims up in arms about the situation? When Muslims in Indonesia kill Christians where is the outrage? Where was the outrage after 9/11? I saw more celebration from the Arab world than condemnation. I will allow that that may have been a result of the media that I was exposed to.

Here's the thing that I find the most disturbing. The Americans go into Iraq and the suicide bombers are getting in line to blow themselves up. When Saddam was terrorizing his own people for almost 20 years, nothing. A few pathetic assassination attempts.

Targets

Submitted by Bob Doney on Thu, 2006-02-02 23:00.

At the same time I fully support the Iraqi and the Afghani resistance which target the American and the western occupiers.

Just one small correction, Aman. The brave Iraqi resistance are mainly targeting their fellow Muslims.

And I think it's a bit rich to blame the Americans for the deaths in the world wars. They were VERY reluctantly dragged into both of them. The majority of the people who died in those wars were Russian, and they were fighting on the same side as the Americans. It was Hitler and the Nazis who were responsible for most of deaths, and they were not famous for liking free democratic elections and free speech.

What do you think of the general elections that have been held in the past year in Iraq? The Iraqis seem to quite like them, judging by the turnout. It's a shame the resistance do their best to disrupt them.

Bob Doney

To Bob

Submitted by Aman on Fri, 2006-02-03 01:53.

When I say resistance, that means the honest people who are defending their land against the us and British soldiers, not those who contributing in the dirty civil war.
And by the way the civil war only started after the invasion of Iraq.
I said that the westerns have killed millions of people during the world wars not just the Americans, I'm sorry but your history ,not ours, is filled of killing bloody wars genocides, racism, fascism, Nazism.
And don't tell me that Bush and Blair are not democratically elected!!! They are committing crimes and you have reelected them
You wrong again regarding the Iraqi elections, actually the resistance stopped its operation during the election period, and most of the people who participated in it were trying to resist the occupation politically, because armed resistance is not enough alone.
I didn't see you writing about the people who are being killed tortured or jailed by the occupation forces, just today few women and children were killed in the Sader city near Baghdad , when american warplanes hit there home with few rockets,
Yeah you brought democracy to the Iraqis but you took there lives!!!

To aman

Submitted by pissed off infiedel (not verified) on Fri, 2006-02-03 11:29.

What say we get out of your dust bowl,give you back saddam let iran build a bomb and blow the whole middle east to bits. it would be cheeper and easiest soulotion thats nmever going to go away

to that infiedel

Submitted by Aman on Wed, 2006-02-08 21:04.

You Said: " What say we get out of your dust bowl,give you back saddam let iran build a bomb and blow the whole middle east to bits "
No get out of Iraq and Take Saddam with you, cuz he is Rumsfild's friend ,and by the way take the American and european oil companies with you. Just a small suggestion: Try to disarm Israel from its 230 atomic and hydrogenic bombs

To aman

Submitted by pissed off infiedel (not verified) on Fri, 2006-02-03 11:28.

What say we get out of your dust bowl,give you back saddam let iran build a bomb and blow the whole middle east to bits. it would be cheeper and easiest soulotion thats nmever going to go away

My history

Submitted by Bob Doney on Fri, 2006-02-03 02:12.

I'm sorry but your history ,not ours, is filled of killing bloody wars genocides, racism, fascism, Nazism.

I'm not claiming ownership of any particular history, so I don't know what you mean by "yours" and "ours". Things get inter-related in history in all sorts of strange ways. For instance, someone mentioned slavery earlier today. Many British people grew very rich as a result of the slave trade, but there again, the British parliament and the Royal Navy were among the first to do anything positive to stamp it out. Goodies or baddies. You decide.

By the way, do Turks count as "yours" or "ours"? But perhaps this isn't the time to re-open the Armenian question!!

Yeah you brought democracy to the Iraqis but you took there lives!!!

A lot of people have died over the centuries in order to establish freedom for ordinary people, like you and me.

Bob Doney

I do not want to import bloody Democracy from the West

Submitted by Aman on Fri, 2006-02-03 03:07.

I'm sorry Bob, but you always answer in the same way" what is we, you, our, us, yours"
I promise to clarify it for you this time
When I mention this historical facts, I just want to refer that ISLAM followers were MOST and not ALL of the time, people who seek peace, they" Muslims" were most of the Time tolerance because Islam ask them to do so, but unfortunately many of those who write comments on this page , just search for any isolated case, crime or what so ever to say that Islam is the problem, while they egnoring huge crime made by people of Christian faith? Isn't strange
Turks were Muslims but this was kind of civil war between the Turks and the Armenians who were accused of supporting the Russians in the war against the Othman empire. It is dirty war as usual
regarding democracy:
you mean that these raids on the innocent homes in Baghdad Fallujah, Ramadi, and every where in Iraq by the American criminals are necessary to bring democracy!!!
who ask you " the US and the British " to make sacrifices of the Iraqi people to bring democracy to them, those countries are the same who supported Saddam in his war against Iran, and in the killing of his own people.
Who provided Saddam with the WMD which he used against his people. When he used it nobody criticized him, and he considered as friend to the US in the eighties and when America decided to capture the Iraqi oil directly, Saddam became suddenly the Devil
Be honest Bob, most of the world know ; it was for oil, and this was the title of all the demonstrations against the invasion, around the world
The world unfortunately is full of dictators, look at africa, most of its leaders are worse than Saddam, why don't the Americans liberates the African countries?
Simply because there is not too much oil there

Bloody democracy

Submitted by Bob Doney on Fri, 2006-02-03 03:36.

I'm sorry Bob, but you always answer in the same way" what is we, you, our, us, yours"

The point I've been feebly trying to make is that I don't have any time for "history as grievances". "My list of war crimes and awful events is longer/shorter than yours".

When I mention this historical facts, I just want to refer that ISLAM followers were MOST and not ALL of the time, people who seek peace, they" Muslims" were most of the Time tolerance because Islam ask them to do so, but unfortunately many of those who write comments on this page , just search for any isolated case, crime or what so ever to say that Islam is the problem, while they egnoring huge crime made by people of Christian faith?

The sad fact is that there have been and continue to be huge crimes in the name of all religions, and none (e.g. atheistic communism).

you mean that these raids on the innocent homes in Baghdad Fallujah, Ramadi, and every where in Iraq by the American criminals are necessary to bring democracy!!!

I don't know. Saddam and his dynasty had to be removed sometime and somehow. Perhaps there would have been a better time or method. Perhaps not.

when America decided to capture the Iraqi oil directly, Saddam became suddenly the Devil

Well, Saddam "suddenly" became the devil when he invaded Kuwait, and that was definitely for the oil! And yes, it's clear that oil is one of the big factors in all this. The "curse of oil" is very far-reaching.

The world unfortunately is full of dictators, look at africa, most of its leaders are worse than Saddam, why don't the Americans liberates the African countries?

Do you think the great democracies (including the predominantly Muslim ones) should try to liberate the peoples living under tyrannical dictators. I think they should, but at present the international will is lacking.

Bob Doney

The real problem.....

Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Fri, 2006-02-03 09:42.

I just wanted to say that the real problem in all of this is:
"atheists" or "non-believers" who say that "believers" (like Muslims for example) are not tolerant are themselves being intolerant!!!!
In fact, it is amazing how the "non-believers" think that they are the ones who are intelligent, who are "on the right track" because they choose to reject the existence of GOD. They think of believers as stupid human beings, and in this sense, Muslims who are particularly keen, not only on "believing",but also on practicing their belief,are regarded as retarded persons.
If you want the believers, Muslims or others, respect your right to reject religion ( which is actually a RIGHT in Islam, belief can not come by coercion)you have to respect their right to believe.
The TWO sides must put things into perspective: Muslims or others might be right or wrong, and "atheists" might be right or wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!
Saying NO to something is not by itself a necessary and sufficient condition that guarantees that you reached the truth!!!!!!!!!!!!!
so my message is to "atheists", "religion" opponents...etc: admit that "your version" might not be the right one and start accepting that there are others, who think differently, are not, nevertheless, STUPID or COERCED or FREAKS.

The real problem?

Submitted by Bob Doney on Fri, 2006-02-03 10:25.

my message is to "atheists", "religion" opponents...etc: admit that "your version" might not be the right one and start accepting that there are others, who think differently, are not, nevertheless, STUPID or COERCED or FREAKS.

OK. My version might not be the "right" one. In fact if the past history of ideas is anything to go by, it is fair to assert that it's likely that everything we think we know now about life, history and the universe will turn out to be "wrong". And if not wrong, then incomplete or misleading.

So what to do? Do I pick a holy book (leave aside the problem of which one to pick!) and say "This is the word of God. It's spot on and holds all the answers to a happy life. I just need to do what it says and everything will be OK." Or do I say, "We are ignorant, foolish beings, but we do have brains that are much more sophisticated than we need for the daily process of staying alive, so let's question everything, and seek to understand in ever more complex and deep ways our universe"?

In this quest we can accept nothing just because someone said it. This leads to doubt and uncertainty, and to a very uncomfortable sense of insecurity. But there again that's realistic, because the more we know about our universe, the clearer it is that it is a very insecure place for our little gang of naked mammals to live. And not least because of the ways our fellow naked mammals think and behave!

Bob Doney

For Aman

Submitted by LoPull on Thu, 2006-02-02 22:36.

I would remind Aman about who started the war between Japan and America; it was Japan. In the end it was their bushido culture that dictated the use of any and all weapons that the United States had at their disposal.

And I would suggest that Aman reread the history of Arab/Islamic countries and the death and distruction that they brought on countries and peoples that had done nothing to them other than not be Arabs or Muslims.

Islam MUST be about killing innocents or there wouldn't be car bombs going off in Iraq at funerals, outside hospitals, and mosques. The Americans and Europeans aren't doing that. It's Sunni vs.Shiite.

I DO find it amusing and puzzling that you, Aman,are obviously living in a western country. Do you think for one minute that you'd be able to do what you are doing here online and in your day to day life if you went back home? If the west and western culture is so bad, why don't Muslims just pack up and leave the US and Europe?

When I see video of people marching in the streets chanting against the west, I wonder how many of them would love nothing better than being able to leave and go live in the very countries that they are protesting against.

for lopull

Submitted by Aman on Fri, 2006-02-03 01:48.

Yes Japan attacked the US first, but do you think that justifies the use of atomic bombs to kill innocent civilians, this is real terrorism .
I've read my history , it's really incomparable to yours,
Muslims didn't kill anybody based on religion" Not like the Nazis who were Christians at the end of the day"
Muslims did not killed or force anybody to convert to Islam contrary to what the Spanish did with both the Muslims and the Jews when they recapture Spain,
Muslims did not kill the original people of any land " The Westerns killed the original people of Australia, America, south Africa"
Is that enough or you want more:
What about the crusade wars in which western Christians killed Muslims and eastern Christians in the holy land
Yes there is ugly war between criminals in Iraq , but the Americans are also contributing in the daily killing of the Iraqis.
You are wrong, I live in my original Muslim country, which is far away from Europe and America, and I do not want to live in Eu or the Us, It's horrible to live among people many of them are full of hatred against others, just like you
P.S it's not a bad idea for Muslims to leave Eu and US but could you please ask the western oil companies to stop stealing our oil and to get out of our countries first
Please

To Aman

Submitted by A New Believer on Mon, 2006-02-06 04:47.

Do not go there about WWII! If the arab countries had launched an attack like that and delivered the declaration of war hours late, after they had bombed the island. If the arab countries had fed chinese infants pure opium, if the arab countries had bayonetted pregnant women and rip the unborn babies out of their wombs. If the arab countries had committed the atrocities they did against, men women and children across China, the Phiilipines, the South Pacific.. then yes.. drop the bomb! My mother had friends in those islands. some of them were Moros ( muslims from the Phillipines) I would tell you what they did to them here.. but none of you muslims would be able to keep the bile from rising in your throats and being sick. So ..so keep you mouth away from WWII. And all of you really need to stop going on about the holocaust as well. Haj Al Husseini ( the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem) was an advisor to Hitler on the Final Solution. Please do not be so hypocritical any longer.

May Fenrir hunt you for rejoicing of such things!

Odin be Praised! Baldur Save Us!

Oh maybe

Submitted by Bob Doney on Fri, 2006-02-03 02:39.

Muslims didn't kill anybody based on religion

Oh, maybe it IS time to re-open the Armenian question!!

Bob Doney

If europe dont buy your

Submitted by tosin (not verified) on Thu, 2006-02-02 12:28.

If europe dont buy your product you all gonna die of hunger you all filled wiv camel shit

it seems muslims are not

Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Thu, 2006-02-02 12:33.

it seems muslims are not prepared to live in west and specially in europe.
they should do like europeans in saudi arabia
we arent allowed to practise our religion there ,so we dont go there.
they must do the same and dont come to europe.
stay in your beloved countries if you feel offended!!
dont come to europe anymore.
and europe must stop sending money to any muslim country.
i guess that ofend them to .wink