Nembegi....

i m a Hindu, born in a Hindu Family, even i m a scholar of Sanskrit.. and even discuss openly with so Gurus.. so here is what i have for you... and your distorted view of Hinduism..

>>Grasshopper is god cat is is god humans is god.
I said, we say whole universe is God. even Rama means the one in every particle. so as i said, parambrahmn means whole universe in itself explain this that why hindus pray everything, and see everything as holy. anyways holiness is also tested in on set of frames of humanity... so we say cow is holy as you use every part of cow... even after cow dies you use each body part of it.

and so do it falls on prophecies... but its not like i can proclaim that i am Holy.. and i am god. it has its well set standards and the degree on which it had helped humanity. so cow is holy, but not god. you are bowing next to that holy part of cow... Even Christians give this promotion to holyness of certain beings... they use a word "Saint"... so people learn that its good to help others.... and by us its a bit of different sort.

>>In Hinduism all scriptures can only be interpreted by a guru.
You are not allowed to learn for yourself.

Again you are 100% wrong, it is said in Hinduism, that god is like a flame en lighting the world, we are like moths roaming around it. we can't see the god completely, but by open discussion we can try to explain the unexplainable.... the God himself. anyways nearly 90% of Hindu holy literatures are written by normal peoples from **so called low class. though it is broad casted day by day in such manner that Hindus are the reason for caste system... but you will not find even a single radical Hindu supporting caste system.

>>These gurus are also worshipped as gods. What they teach is that humans need libiration from the never ending cycle of reincarnations (samsara) which is caused be karma.

when you say "Namahstey".. it is a mix of 3 words.. "Na" is negation. "Mah" means me/I... (your ego).."astey" means to bow.

In short it means that i bow next to your inner truth, the part which you own from holy god... but i don't bow next to your ego. so what you say is again what you see, but don't understand. the liberation from birth cycle means to get out of the cycle of particle-energy transformations. so your soul set free yourself free without any anchor left to hold it. with Hindu theory, reincarnation means to come from the energy form to particle form in any form.

>>In other words each Hindu must come to realise that he himself is god.

If a person thinks he is God, then thats egoism.... which always ends towards destruction. and we have been told from childhood to search the inner truth.... not to proclaim that i am god.

>>Hindus teach that suffering peeple should be left to suffer.
Again, you are wrong, Hinduism never says to let a person suffer. its one of the biggest sin in us, to let a person suffer. you will no where find such a crap idea in any Hinduism religious book. anyways sorry to day, but the way you are interpreting karma is as much wrong as your complete view of Hinduism.

I really dont know, which book is putting such distorted backward view of Hinduism inside you... if someone will ask be, i will say Hinduism is far more liberal in its real form.. in fact its the only religion which provide rights for all to exist toughener, oppose polygamy and so on..

though the new radical right Hindu wing claims to be Hindu, but they really ignore Hindu literatures from 4BC onwards.

the only thing i will say is, every glitter is not gold, and even diamond can be hidden inside coals.

Hindus teach that suffering peeple should be left to suffer. Why is that ms. perfectm? It is bcecause it is there destiney as determined by karma. Let them suffer.

All Hindus must become gods but this can only be acheeved by following Jnana Yoga - salvation by devotion to one of the many Hindu gods. Bhakti Yoga.

Karma Yoga is salvation by works fasting and pilgramiges which must be done without rewards. All of thees methods will include Raja Yoga - meditation to control the body breathing and thoughts.

Need more teechings on your relegen ? But Hindus are not muslims so acceptible. As are Africans for sexs with blue eyes Euros womans. :D
We agree on that one.

Oops you know nothing abvout Hindu.

Hinduism is pantheistic.This means god is all and everything. Grasshopper is god cat is is god humans is god. All humans is Brahman. You meditat on Atman (the true self) so that Atman is realised as Brahman. The depth of the soul is identical to the depth of the universe.

In Hinduism all scriptures can only be interperted by a guru. You are not allowed to learn for youreself. These gurus are also worshipped as gods. What they teach is that humans need libiration from the never ending cycle of reincarnations (samsara) which is caused be karma.

Liberations (moksha) is finally when humans realise that Atman (the self) is the same as Brahman.

In other words each Hindu must come to realise that he himself is god.

Need I go on ? I knows much much more ms. perfectm. Who loves Hindus now.

oops we also have only 1 god, named parambrahmn

and 7 million are (devi devta.. refered as deities in engish)... but i will rather say that they are superhumans with special powers provided by god. :D

Most of them are son of gods... but its not equivalent to Jesus here...as Jesus earn a place equivalent to Krishna in Hindu Literatures from 1st century. this was work of saint thomas... the differacne is the view port.... where Judeo-christian culture says he was son of God, old hindu testimonials says he was incarnation of Vishnu.

so what is Vishnu ? well Parambrahmn(check above) consitute whole universe, also refered as hindu universe many times from peoples... he is good, as well as bad, pure as well as evil, in short is he beyong explainable and beyond defineable...

with hindu litrature.. man is interested, and can explain limited part of parambrahmn... this is Shiva (matter.. masculine in sanskrit) and shakti(energy.. feminine in sanskrit grammar)...

they are interchangeable, and this is what "Ardhnarieshwar" describes.... Vishnu evolves from shiva, and Vishnu repersents the "living stock", and last is Brahma... a subset of Vishnu.. this repersent the holy soul...

for hindus then whole things are holy, as they all have part of god in them... and the most holy of all those humans are usually judged next to the set of prophecies... we call them incarnation in hinduism.... and Jesus also pass all those standards... and hindus had accepted Jesus far back in 1st century... when the colonialization entered india, they were amazed to find Christians and hindus praying side by side... but they never tried to understand what was that.. infact they feeled ashmed as Hindus were tagged as Pagans under islam. the effect was the starting of division between hindus and christians...

Anyways the most basic standard og judging a prophecy is to judge it next to its contribution to humantity.... many muslims claims that Mohammed is prophetised in Hinduism.... but they ignore that Mohammed never brought even a single good thing to humanity

My frend I need your help here

http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/1995#comment

btw, a dove is not a crow nor is a christian a muslim. need help from hindu gods (all 7 million) :D

The lights remains....
Search the truth....
the darkness can never end the light... only it can hide it for a while.....

what exactly do you have against muslims? perhaps i can help clear up things :-)

Neither Do I , this is what someone said while I was attending a Management Conference on the Indian Sub continent and the topic of Multi-tasking came up, and I was told to get it translated and keep shhhh... sadly no one would do me the honours, have a rough idea as to it being derogatory but to the point.

Dont worry. I'll get a mate to do it. I kind of know what your saying.

Sorry boss. Can't speak Urdu or Hindi. Please translate.

Take your time tomorrow is fine.

A Student Eh! - Good luck with the Exams

Multi Tasking (EXAMS & CRICKET ) a good skill but here is a piece of advice that I picked up in your neck of the woods, decipher it but keep it to yourself

DO NAV PE CHADNA AUR GAAND FAT KE MAARNA, does it make any sense?

Thank you for your message, sir.

I will reply to it tommorrow. Unfortunately I have exams at the moment and the crickets on too. Need to have a good think.

My post was a send up of the cartoon racism, negative caricatures and sweeping genralisations of anti-Islam/anti-immigrant posters found on this website.

I would still be interested to know your thoughts about how to dilute Islam as you had mentioned in the previous post, this is the first time in my experience some one is willing to have a debate on the issue from your community and reflects a sea change in the staleness, if as you say that there are a lot of negative and sweeping generalisations about anti Islam then don’t you think that you as possibly a moderate sort of a guy owe it to your community to engage in an informed debate about the whole issue, I am sick and tired of most statements from your community including the so called heads from Religious and Political sectors always claiming that other people, the governments, the police and the rest of the communities should ‘engage’ with the Muslim communities, my simplistic view is, the onus is on the Muslim communities in the UK and elsewhere ‘TO ENGAGE’ with the rest of us, as it is they who have chosen to emigrate to these shores, as it is the same if we Brits go to OZ then the onus is upon us to engage and not the other way round. - What say you?

Here are some issues/ questions etc of mine and no doubt of many others, let’s see if we can sensibly debate without going off at a tangent with accusations etc.

1. How would you set about to reform or strongly dilute Islam and what criteria would you include and how would you sell it to your community?

2. How and Who should stand up to the ‘extremist’ elements? – I say it should be the Muslim community themselves, it is a cancer and should be eradicated from within, do you accept and agree?

3. Do you believe that your community could participate in an informed and an all inclusive debate without the ‘In your face aggression’ or demonstrations followed up by threats/ Fatwas etc?

4. Do you agree that most Muslims by the way of their behaviour and operating closed communities invite others to pick on them and create mistrust?

5. Would you accept that Muslims flee their native lands, from despotic regimes and extreme social customs but then end up practising them over here?

6. Why is it that Muslims never condemn other Muslims who carry out terrorist acts, instead they disclaim responsibility of terrorism by other Muslims?

7. Why would Muslims not inform the authorities if they came to know of terrorism being planned by fellow Muslims?

8. Why do Muslims always have pre-requisite conditions of their acceptance to either British Nationality, integration etc? an example that springs to mind is the obsession of ‘British Foreign Policy’ being the cause of extremism amongst young British Born Muslims, If any British policy causes offence to their loyalty to foreign lands, then they should go to those countries – do you agree?

There is lots more but let’s start here and see where this leads to.

We shall agree to disagree.

OK , however, there wasn’t much to disagree, you had made some valid points but without the proper facts or background and they were also made in the same vain as the lady in question, the difference being she is troubled and you certainly are not, hence my attempt to redress the balance somewhat.

My post was a send up of the cartoon racism, negative caricatures and sweeping genralisations of anti-Islam/anti-immigrant posters found on this website.

If what you say here is true and you find all the above repulsive then you should have refrained your self from making such wild and mostly offensive comments, I am not disputing the actual events that you raised only the spirit they were raised in, I would strongly dispute with you about the post that I responded to initially, was anywhere near an attempt to reflect the above, it actually came across clearly as an attempt of ‘Hindu Bashing’.

Further, careful who you ally yourself with. I doubt the storm troopers would differentiate between an Indian Hindu or a Banladeshi Muslim if Arkan style death squads ever come to take away those "filthy" Muslims who threaten the peaceful, toelrant, liberal European way of life.

Sorry, you have lost me on this one, I am neither an Indian nor a Bangla Deshi, nor an ally of anyone, I am a free thinker and respond to anything I strongly disagree with or to gross misrepresentation, what exactly are you endeavouring to put across, it hasn’t come across, pardon my ignorance but please shed further light.

On a happier note; the West Indies were superb, however, I doubt they will keep this kind of form up. Scotland did themselves proud. I think the final four will be India, South Africa, Oz and England with South Africa to beat Oz in an enthralling final.

I agree, the Windies were awesome and perhaps will fizzle out, the test would be their temperament when they loose a match and their ability to handle pressure, Scotland most certainly did came across well and could be a force to be reckoned with in the future given the right guidance, Um! Not too sure about us being in there with Jimmy Anderson wavering but will do our confidence a world of good, but if one is honest and wants fireworks to fly around then the final four that will provide that will be the following semi finals

INDIA v PAKISTAN and OZ v S.A and yes it is about time someone beats OZ, if only for the sheer good of the game’s future, just like when Alonso beat Shueeee.

Well we know Maonist rabells.... and we also know from where they are getting the arms...

how come Islam comes in between... perhaps you can tell me....
why ISI support Maonist.... and provides its weaponary to maonist using Bangladesh...

Again the "Tablighis" comes in light..... just see.... ISI governed by Tablighi Jamaat--(Well known fact from Bosnian-Serbian fight.... when ISI supplied complex Anti-tank weaponary to Bosnian Muslim).... and till where i know bangladeshi's hold 2nd largest gathering of Muslims(of tablighi Jamaat) every year.... and we are well known how Tablighis work .....

Manmohan think in his way.... and i think to concentrate on root cause of all evils... and i know where it is....... its in a religion which grow on foundation of lies.... playing game of taqiyya. when i am right, this was also the story behind success of ottoman empire. but lies are not for always. and taqiyya lies will also fall soon.

Whats your take on this:

India's Prime Minister Manmohan Singh recently described Maoist rebels as the biggest single internal security threat the country has ever faced.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/5071784.stm

Seems like you may have your priorties wrong.

We shall agree to disagree.

My post was a send up of the cartoon racism, negative caricatures and sweeping genralisations of anti-Islam/anti-immigrant posters found on this website. Further, careful who you ally yourself with. I doubt the storm troopers would differentiate between an Indian Hindu or a Banladeshi Muslim if Arkan style death squads ever come to take away those "filthy" Muslims who threaten the peaceful, toelrant, liberal European way of life.

On a happier note; the West Indies were superb, however, I doubt they will keep this kind of form up. Scotland did themselves proud. I think the final four will be India, South Africa, Oz and England with South Africa to beat Oz in an enthralling final.

sam... what else you do instead of spreading taqiyya...

here is why Gujarat riots started.... anyone will get provoked by insane work what Muslims had done...here is a dig about 2002 riots... why they happen...

http://www.ibnlive.com/news/5-years-on-gujarat-willing-to-forget-not-forgive/34986-3.html

By the way... Sam, if i am right Tablighi jamaat was the group behind London Mega Mosque project... just was wondering... that Tablighi Jamaat was behind Bosnian-serbian problem... behind Gujarat riots.... behind Uaganda and somalia Muslim militancy, behind london bombing and so on.... so why you cry, if things go against islam. for sure with such act Muslims will not get you a gold medal... perhaps some 72 virtual virgins in a virtual world of paradise...

and its you who is quoting that in Africa Islam is not a problem, ignoring the fact that it was fellow Muslims who killed other Muslims because they are black or because they refused to accept the radical brand of islam.(dependent of country... Nigeria and sudan are also considered).... and we also know what secures christians.... the same thing which started dowry.... Jaziya tax...

wanna blame me back....history speak in itself a lot.... check the dates of orignation of dowry system... and its enterance in society.... all today existing evils in hinduism are gift of hindus approach to peacefully merge with Muslim....well here are my words...

La..ILLLAHA..ILL...BLA-BLA - Mohammad Rasool saitan...

@ Kid Sammy

There you go proving my point, Muslims never answer questions but muddy waters with irrelevant diatribe and answer questions with questions, it seems a bit rich claiming that you are anti religion, hardly reflected in your rant in response to the lady in question and if so then I hardly noticed any anti Islamic criticism in your rant, the kind that was mentioned in my so called rant.

I most definitely didn't miss the underlying attempt within your rant but you most definitely have missed my point by miles as your response demonstrates it so eloquently.

If as you say now that you think that the lady is deranged then you should have ignored her like the rest of us had, but instead you were quick off the mark to condemn Indians and Hindus, hardly a criticism you can lay at the Indians doorstep. It was you who were opportunistic to try and score cheap points at the expense of a seriously troubled lady who seems in obvious distress about something. And as far as me being right wing Islamophobic, I do have a very valid reason to be that way and so are many others who have been pushed in the corner by the Islamists, I didn’t join the 1971 war against Pakistan for fun kid.

It is typical of you Muslims to jump from one topic to another so as to avoid as addressing the matters in hand. If you had taken the trouble to read my rant carefully then you would have noticed that I did not condone any of the acts by Hindus either, but was merely putting across the proud record of the Muslims as they are not innocent in any of this There is no need to have a campaign to establish atrocities by any race, the fact remains that Muslims have committed more atrocities ever in the history of mankind then all the other races put together. – END OF CHAT

The Muslim women in Islamic counties are not any better treated, the killings go on in vast numbers, the only difference is that unlike decent and civilised societies and democracies, the despotic regimes within the Islamic world don't have the same freedom of expression which allows such issues to come to the surface and so they claim to be holier than thou, at least the Indians are bringing matters to the surface in order to eradicate such evil practices and have recently introduced laws to stop husbands battering their wives just like any civilised country, hardly the same could be said of any Islamic country could it?

If you are anti religion then lets hear your views on conforming Islam and convince the rest of us of your honourable intentions.

Take your time to compile a response, you will need it to try and convince the World at large about honourable Islamic intentions, like the holy grail, it doesn’t exist it’s only a figment of Islamic propaganda.

On the topic of Cricket, did you enjoy the match yesterday ?

This is a very weird thread. I think this woman is mentally deranged. If not, then she is a troll.
However, I think you miss my point entirely.
In terms of FGM; I believe this is an African tribal custom found in Christian, Muslim and Animist communities. I can only conclude that to attribute  it is only Islamic is to blatantly lie to fit in with your political right wing Islamophobic agenda.
Further, you have me wrong. I am anti-religion. If anything Islam needs to be diluted strongly.
However, I was merely making the point that Indians especially should not be so quick to condemn. For a report on dowry killings in India see:
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/asia/article1932745.ece
"Last year 6,787 cases were recorded of women murdered by their husbands or their husbands' families because of their dowries. Many die in "stove burnings": set alight by husbands or in-laws who then claim it was a kitchen accident"
So, shall we have a campaign now on BJ about the horrendous crimes committed by Hindus? Will Cobra boy give us a rant about which particular Hinud texts advocate the burning alive of young women because their families didn't hand over enough cash on their wedding day? No? I wonder why not. When throwing around accusations of cultural equivalence, perhaps you need to look more closely at those you appear to be aligning yourself with. It seems to me that as far as some on here are concerned, violence against women is only important and only heinous when it's committed by Muslims. Well tell that to the 6,787 dead Indian women, tell them their lives and deaths weren't worth your attention because they happened to be the wrong religion.
Am busy now. Will give you a proper answer after the cricket world cup.

8. Mrs Tataratty talks about donkeys and goats in one of her earlier rants. That’s a bit rich considering the national dish of India is chilled monkey brains and snake surprise.

Your brains have most definitely slipped up your nether regions, that one is new on even the most unaware individual about Indian Cuisine; surely it is the Far East and China that specialises in such dishes. What about your lot in the Middle East gorging Sheep’s Eye Balls and Testicles.

9. My neighbour recently gave birth to a beautiful baby girl and was told by her health visitor that tuberculosis was now prevalent in Scotland again after many years. This was not due to Arabs or Eastern Europeans but was attributed to disease ridden Indians arriving from Madras and Bangalore to work in call centres. Millions have now been wasted on vaccination programmes by the health board.

Why do you forget that you are also living in Scotland, are you sure it isn’t your lot that have spread it as a ‘Biological’ warfare and if you look into the issue of disease that is on the Indian Sub Continent, you will find it is most definitely attributable to the Muslim population in the slums who spread it, they are the ones that breed like germs as they don’t believe in birth control and often live 15 – 20 in on room slums in India, I wonder if you recall, the forceful vasectomies that were carried in India in the Eighties by Sanjay Gandhi in an attempt to eradicate disease within the slums and the entire Muslim world came down on him like a ton of bricks, as the majority of them were Muslims.

10. Incidentally, my neighbour tells me that during her c-section, her surgeon was from Egypt, the midwife from Iran, the anaesthetist from Pakistan. Experience shows me that Muslim communities are making valuable contributions to our societies whilst we sit and listen to people like Mrs Parmaham spew her nonsense.

So it is true that the West is being infiltrated by Muslim communities, they are now moving into the medical sector, bloody hell people we need to be even more vigilant, a Pakistani anaesthetist, what concoction of chemical warfare are we going to be subjected to next, it is like ‘V’ all over again, they are among our midst.

Mr Iqbal learn to look into your own Islamic background before embarking on taking pot shots at others with lies and half baked wish lists.

In conclusion, the Muslim people have always been barbarians and have always believed in taking wealth and land not belonging to them by force, they have never been successful in cultivating anything of their own; they always look upon their neighbours with envy on their success and through deceit, rape, force and robbery attempt to ascertain others’ riches, the history is full of evidence to that affect. Look at Pakistan, where is it today in comparison to India in terms of progress even with the support of the rich Arab nations and up until now the Western nations, nowhere, it has stolen the nuclear technology from the Dutch deceitfully, the trend is endemic and a trait of the Muslims.

You have to accept the fact and realise that you Muslims are not progressive people which is why you are not only incompatible with the technically advanced West but also with the spiritual East, over the centuries everything you have touched you have destroyed and yet you can’t see that because you are in denial.

Most Muslims just try to defend the indefensible, that is the problem with Muslims, they can’t take constructive criticism, instead come out with some of the most obvious and blatantly ridiculous arguments in defense.

The other major weakness within the makeup of Muslims is that they don’t develop as free thinkers (admittedly not all) and apply their own judgement to any given situation, to them Islam is the thought and Mohammed did the thinking for them, you live and breathe Islam, you have never tried thinking outside the box, hence you are inward looking people thus limited in being progressive i.e. outward looking.

5. It is still common for Hindu widows to jump into her dead husbands funeral pyre throughout rural India. last year alone, over 50,000 women killed themselves this way. Again, this virtually unheard of anywhere in the world.

An absolute lie, you and your kind always quote rubbish statistics branded about by your very kind in an attempt to discredit the Indians, again a lack of knowledge and ignorance on your part is evident, the old Hindu tradition of ‘Sati’ meaning the ‘Pure’ one was a method chosen by Hindu wives and especially, the queens, who chose and were never forced to perform this brave act in order to save their honour after the husbands death from the barbaric Muslims who had invaded Ancient India, and prior to that it was a ritual chosen by wives who saw no point in living after the passing on of their husbands, as it was a view that their lives weren’t worth living as in those days women didn’t go to work, only the man was the sole provider, and also to save their honour from being violated by others, in my opinion a very brave and extreme measure but nevertheless something prevalent of those times, and yes some have chosen to do that in recent times in Rajasthan (the land of the Maharajas and the Rajput clans) where honour is the order of the day, rightly or wrongly, but this ritual is categorically not an Indian Government Policy and where and whenever possible it is actively discouraged.

6. Any religion which worships bats, rats, cats, hogs and dogs amongst other things cannot surely be taken seriously in any way whatsoever.

So are you advocating that we should take seriously a nutters cult formed by a paedophile and a barbarian which has no regard for even other humans let alone animals, where torture of animals is the order of the day (halal).

You are the most ignorant person of any kind I have ever come across, you know nothing of the Hindu religion and religious beliefs and its regard for not only humans but it also has a equal regard for the animal kingdom, it is the only religion that actively promotes the rights of animals and endeavours to treat them with regard and respect, and actually designates the status and recognises the contribution of the various animals in the daily lives of human beings, they don’t worship any animals as such, it only appreciates the animal kingdom as equals in a spiritual sense, something you Muslims haven’t the capacity to comprehend or appreciate, as you are merely of a barbaric nature. We in Britain and the west also keep pets and respect the rights of animals, or else what is the animal rights campaign, albeit it has been hijacked by extremists in the recent past, but the sentiment isn’t any different.

7. I will not even begin to mention the standard of hygeine of most Indians I come across apart from the fact that you can smell them before you see them.

This takes the biscuit, it is the pot calling the kettle black, I am sure most others on the BJ will vouch that it is the Muslims that don’t even have personal hygiene in their vocabulary and dictionary, most Bangla Deshi’s and Pakistani’s and Arabs are the worst, and in fact in the UK it is them that no one wants to sit next to on the Buses or Trains and in Offices and in fact it is mostly the Muslims that in general one can smell from miles away, and their homes also consistently pour a foul and vile odour in the atmosphere, in fact in my opinion it is the one thing that causes more pollution then anything else, you are having a laugh aren’t you.

3. The Hindu caste system is the most disgraceful religous activity today bringing untold misery to millions of people around the country. An educated Hindu once told me he would rather eat from the plate of a dog than to even sit at the same table as a Dalit speaks volumes.

You have exceeded the wildest levels of ‘Ignorance’ in highlighting your lack of knowledge about the ‘Hindu Caste’ system, I refer you to an account by the French Journalist Francoise Gautier who has a wealth of knowledge on the subject and is not the only westerner to actually understand the original system that existed before it was bastardised by the invading Islamic people and later us British to divide and rule, the only sad fact remains is that the Hindus haven’t had the courage to restore it to the original purpose it was designed for, it was the most civilised system and a sign of an advanced culture that existed during the ‘Vedic’ times.

Although, admittedly it has been hijacked by the few to oppress others and to use it to suit their own form of interpretation, but this goes on even in the west, you probably, don’t know the British Class system of not so long ago, and the signs in English Bed and Breakfast accommodations clearly saying “No Blacks and Irish Dogs” and are you claiming that we in Britain are of clear conscience in not having mutual dislike of each other, i.e the Welsh and Scots and the Irish’s dislike of the English and vice versa, and what do you think the Northern Ireland struggle has been all about?

And as far as one educated Hindu’s statement is concerned it is hardly a general opinion and more so it just reflects one individual’s or even a group of individuals’ opinion but certainly not the norm, you obviously, haven’t seen the efforts made in that country to endeavour to bring the Dalits in to the mainstream of Indian society and as in any decent country it is an offence to discriminate against any minority, however, there are external forces in operation like the Muslims who incite these people in order to convert them to Islam, this trend has been in existence even in the West or haven’t you noticed.

4. Over 2 million baby girls in India are either killed or deposited in government baby bins every year. This level of anti female violence is again unheard of anywhere in the world.

Really, what about the treatment of females in the Islamic world, hardly a glowing example of honour and integrity, accepted that poor and illiterate people in India do see female child as a burdensome responsibility, (shameful and not to be condoned) but you are forgetting that these figures are also inclusive of Muslim population.

What about the recent Channel Four documentary on the plight of the Educated and liberated Muslim women not allowed to even enter the Mosques in Modern British Muslims and the abuse of women within the Muslim culture and the honour killings that take place within the modern Muslim communities, wake up Mr. Iqbal the abuse of women is an international phenomenon or else there wouldn’t be ‘Battered Wives’ homes everywhere and if you care to research within the UK ones, you will find that the majority of them are women from the Muslim community. Recently a local Pakistani born dentist’s British born muslim wife ran away with her two girls claiming torture and inhuman behaviour.

The Muslims can hardly claim to be the champions of women’s rights, you hardly recognise them as even humans, visit Pakistan, the Middle East or any Muslim country for that matter and it will become evident that your kind are the worst perpetrators of violence against women. Isn’t it your lot that still carry out female circumcision forcefully in most cases.

You are also disingenuous in claiming that bad treatment of minorities is an Indian phenomenon, open your eyes and you will see it around yourself, what would you call what Saddam was doing to the thousands in Iraq and what is still going on in Iraq and why is it that the Royal Saudis have contempt for the rest of the Muslim world. Why are the Pakistan government systematically eliminating the Baluchi people? What rights do Christians, Hindus or Buddhists have in Pakistan, please enlighten us.

In fact, there is more bad treatment of minorities in Arab and Muslim countries then anywhere else, and yet you Muslims claim injustice against yourselves everywhere in the world. How much religious freedom do the Muslim and Arab nations extend to the Christians and Hindus ? How many Temples and Churches are there in Saudi Arabia or for that matter in other Arab countries?

Take for example the 2002 anti-Muslim pogroms which resulted in the deaths of 2500 Muslims and over 200,000 refugees. The State was complicit in this and numerous eye witness accounts reveal the murder, rape and bludgeoning to death of women, children and the elderly.

Again, you have decided to pick an example of mass public riots and the subsequent killings that had taken place, but once again failed to highlight the attempts made by the government to bring people to justice, I accept that there were atrocities committed but that is what happens when humans become insane, sanity goes out of the window and the beast within takes over, not that I or any sane person would condone such behaviour, but you have again not mentioned the atrocities committed by the Muslims within India during the partition in 1947 in Kashmir and elsewhere in India, and it is rich of you to make claims that it doesn’t happen anywhere else, have you been on inter-galactic travels on the ‘Voyager’ and have missed the mass suicide bombings within Israel, India, UK, Indonesia and not to forget 9/11, what do you call that?

No doubt there are many Hindus like Mrs Parmeswar who quietly cheered these events which tells us what kind of nation this really is. Indigenous Westerners should be ever so careful of outsiders who come to our countries spewing their vicious bile against other minorities.

I have lived amongst Hindus and have never found the masses to be as insensitive as you have attempted to portray, in fact the vast majority are extremely peace loving people and have non violence enshrined not only in their hearts and minds but also in their religious beliefs’. Forgotten Gandhi and the non violence movement, but then again what would a Barbaric Race ever know about peace.

And, as far as us westerners are concerned, we are only too well aware as to who the culprits are that are spewing the vile poison and are only too alert, it is the Muslims, Mr. Iqbal.

My understanding is that this women is not for real. However, I would like to make a few observations

This is a typical response from Muslims trying to discredit others when most of what the lady states here might not have been eloquently put but having spent over 8 years in India I can vouch for almost every charge she lays against the Muslims. God only knows what torture and mental cruelty the poor woman and her family have endured which has led to her present state of mind.

1.This disturbing and disgusting attitude towards Muslims should be condemned by all of us. Extremism in all its formats needs to be eradicated.

The fact remains that Muslims are deservedly condemned because the annals of history are full of all the most heinous activities committed against, not only the Hindus but others also, which is why you will not have people’s ear MR IQBAL as they know too well the Islamic people, they are like the parasites that eat people from within, a view expressed by many on BJ

2. My own experiences tell me that this woman's sweeping generalisations are largely mainstream Hindu nationalist opinion in India. I am constantly surprised how this jumped up backwater continues to defy criticism from liberal Westerners particularly in its treatment of minorities. Christians, Dalits, Muslims and even Buddhists are discriminated against in such a way that is unheard of even in any Arab country.

You can hardly blame the Hindus in India and elsewhere for their contempt for the Muslims, as those poor bastards have had it bad for over ten centuries, Mr. Iqbal your lot have systematically decimated, raped the Hindu nation over that period of time and most recent attempt has been taking a piece of the land from the once great Empire and are endeavouring to annexe Kashmir.

Even so, India (although in my humble opinion foolishly) has given it’s Muslim population each and every equal opportunity and rights that it has bestowed upon the Hindus and others, it has numerous successful Muslim artiste, technicians and film stars in ‘Bollywood’ numerous politicians and even two Muslim Presidents, name me even one such example of honour the Muslim world has extended to people from the ethnic minorities. All those ethnic minorities that want success badly have achieved it in India and elsewhere but sadly, a minority of extremist Muslims in the main in India, incited by Pakistan have chosen to make matters worse, as they have no intention to either educate themselves or have the mental capacity to participate in anything civilised or being progressive, they take pride in clouding the issues by claiming injustice, now where have I heard that one before, Oh yes in my native Britain and the West. Oh by the way the most popular Defence Minister of India during the 70’s and Early Eighties during Indira Gandhi’s tenure was a Dalit namely Mr. Jag Jeevan Ram and I don’t recall anyone discriminating against him and others like him or refusing to sit at the same table and eat with him.

The discriminations you talk about against various people has never been an Indian Government policy nor did I find over the 8 years of my time spent there and most recently I had been there in 2004 and 2005. You conveniently forget that it is India that has given refuge to thousands of Buddhists including the Dalai Lama within India, and also Mother Teresa’s ‘CHRISTIAN’ organisation given all the opportunities of equality, hardly a bad treatment policy, and as long as the ‘Dalits’ are concerned my observations have been to the extreme opposite to your ridiculous claims of lies, if you had taken the pains to see what enormous efforts the Indian Government has made to improve the plight of all those people then you wouldn’t be making such ignorant statements, and as far as people’s personal attitudes and prejudices are concerned, it is not something that doesn’t exist anywhere in the world, even in the so called ‘First World’ western world, the only thing governments can do is to educate people in addressing their fears of the unknown.

sam... nice words... but u forgot to speak about the muslim roots of indian problems...

so in which frame should i place you? i accept this women is not not behaving normal.... but her abnormal behavior also speaks of some horrible suffering due to islam.....

i think Mr. Iqbal (normally a Muslim name), instead of behaving anti Blair, anti Bush... you should work more against Anti-Islamist. we have no problem with Muslims, but we do have problem with Islam. hopefully instead of asking to place the women in mental hospital.. you will ask to place Imam of your mosque in mental hospital.... at last this women is no threat to us... but your imams asking to kill infidels do makes a big threat.

My understanding is that this women is not for real. However, I would like to make a few observations.

1. This disturbing and disgusting attitude towards Muslims should be condemned by all of us. Extremism in all its formats needs to be eradicated.
2. My own experiences tells me that this woman's sweeping generalisations are largely mainstream Hindu nationalist opinion in India. I am constantly surprised how this jumped up backwater continues to defy criticism from liberal Westerners particularly in its treatment of minorities. Christians, Dalits, Muslims and even Buddhists are discriminated against in a such a way that is unheard of even in any Arab country. Take for example the 2002 anti-Muslim pogroms which resulted in the deaths of 2500 Muslims and over 200,000 refugees. The State was complicit in this and numerous eye witness accounts reveal the murder, rape and bludgeoning to death of women, children and the elderly. No doubt there are many Hindus like Mrs Parmeswar who quietly cheered these events which tells us what kind of nation this really is. Indigenous Westerners should be ever so careful of outsiders who come to our countries spewing their vicious bile against other minorities.
3. The Hindu caste system is the most disgraceful religous activity today bringing untold misery to millions of people around the country. An educated Hindu once told me he would rather eat from the plate of a dog than to even sit at the same table as a a Dalit speaks volumes.
4. Over 2 million baby girls in India are either killed or deposited in government baby bins every year. This level of anti female violence is again unheard of anywhere in the world.
5. It is still common for Hindu widows to jump into her dead husbands funeral pyre throughout rural India. last year alone, over 50,000 women killed themselves this way. Again, this virtually unheard of anywhere in the world.
6. Any religion which worships bats, rats, cats, hogs and dogs amongst other things cannot surely be taken seriously in any way whatsoever.
7. I will not even begin to mention the standard of hygeine of most Indians I come across apart from the fact that you can smell them before you see them.
8. Mrs Tataratty talks about donkeys and goats in one of her earlier rants. Thats a bit rich considering the national dish of India is chilled monkey brains and snake surprise.
9. My neighbour recently gave birth to a beautiful baby girl and was told by her health visitor that tuberculosis was now prevalent in Scotland again after many years. This was not due to Arabs or Eastern Europeans but was attributed to disease ridden Indians arriving from Madras and Bangalore to work in call centres. Millions have now been wasted on vaccination programmes by the health board.
10. Incidentally, my neighbour tells me that during her c-section, her surgeon was from Egypt, the midwife from Iran, the anaesthetist from Pakistan. Experience shows me that Muslim communities are making valuable contributions to our societies whilst we sit and listen to people like Mrs Parmaham spew her nonsense.

Would someone please deal with this troll.

Thanks for the info. Quite disturbing.

Het is beter om de waarheid te verklaren en worden verworpen dan het in te houden om worden goedgekeurd.

what are you doing with Menorah.... you should burn a " diya "..

don't worry.... just a few greetings from another hindu indian.
have fun... as i understand that both menorah and diya are used to light up holy fires, and they enlighten everything around with the glow, though they keep there own base in darkness....

this is a symbol for G-d, who, with his love enlighten the life of all humans beings, without differentating which religion he follows and what he does..... this love is also what connects us with each other, and make us feel and share the pain of each other. Perhaps this can provide the answer back to the jewish lady, who asked why it takes evil away. Because it symbolise the G-d, which is undescribeable, just like light of the lamp/menorah.... he enlights the whole world, but his own identity is hidden/unseenable/undescribeable. we humans like fire-flies goes and away from this flame......

anyways do take precautions as childerns are attracted by fire.. and they play around glowing things... :)
and Arjun is a real nice name

is this a way of saying "let them eat cake",

Pork, beef or mutton in the soup: anyway vegetarians as well as veganists are being discriminated. Any meat in the soup is racist.

Actually Islam is little more than a Pan-Arab ideology based on hardline Judaic intellectual foundations. Without Islam, Arabs would be little more than the disparate tribes they once were; non-Arab Muslims exist because of either conquest, or because Islam, like Communism, seems to appeal to underdogs with a healthy dislike of Western civilization, Europeans, and their descendants. Islam effectively is a non-White religion, aside from Bosnia-Herzegovina and some statistically insignificant Europeans, North Americans, Aussies, and Kiwis. Even if every White person converted to Islam tomorrow, I doubt they would be on an equal footing with the Arabs, or Persians if they were Shi'ite.

and there I was thinking Garlic not Pork warded off evil spirits.............but I couldn't see a French Court banning Garlic now

This is so stupid I'm going to go eat a porkchop and make sure I've got enough ammo set aside greased in pork grease.

I was going to help an old lady across the street over the weekend, but had a sudden pang of guilt over such a discriminatory act - her being just an old white chick and all - and changed my mind so as not to ruffle any feathers. She got hit by a bus.... Oh well, as the French say - C'EST LA VIE !!!!

Distributing pig meat soup is against the law - strictly enforced
Burning vehicles and occupants is against the law- rarely enforced
 
What is the French definition of "threatens public order"?

How come the muslims in France don't refuse the welfare money, as the whole stash is tainted with millions of Euros in VAT-tax collected from pork's meat sales ?!?!

What's next? a ban on the free distribution of gluhwein on Christmas markets?

So now even as a voluntary donor of food, SdF has to be PC?  Its other choice being offering no food anymore.  Would then the majority of the poor/homeless be any better off? (I'm assuming in France the majority of poor/homeless is still non-muslim, otherwise France would be in troulble.  I know, I know, it's in trouble already.  But more apeasement from the government won't help them, but I guess they don't know that)  

Interestingly Muslims always try to play the racist card when it comes to their religion and neither logic nor common sense provide a rescue for their arguments.

Yet religion has nothing to do with race. Muslims may be of black, brown or white color. They may be of European, Asian, African or Arab descent.
Anyone can change his religion, noone is born with a religion. It's a set of values, rules and principles that has nothing to do with the colour of your skin.
Much like communism or any other ideology's or political party's guidelines.
Anyone can become a muslim or quit being a muslim, depending on himself (let's put his brother's violent reaction aside). Like anyone can become or quit being a Christian or Buddhist. It has nothing to do with your skin's colour, so racism can be no argument.
If critizing or not willing to cater to the needs of islam is racist, criticizing any political party or any club with a set of rules, regardless of what they are could be considered racism, too.
Because the criticized party's member will almost surely disagree with any critics. And they might feel even offended.
Which, in the case of islam almost automatically translates into calling the critics racist and makes his acts a crime.
So why should criticizing islam be considered racist, but criticizing democracy, liberalism, communism, the EU or even Christianity not??
Why can I, as a nonmarxist, nonbuddhist, nonvegetarian choose whether I abide to the rules of Buddishm, the teachings of Marx , Vegetarianism - or not. So why am supposed then to abide to the rules of islam if I am not a muslim? Opening a restaurant as a nonmuslim serving exclusively pork products would be considered racist and prosecutable, if I read the article well.
Or turned around - if criticizing liberalism, communism, the EU or Christianity are not considered acts of racism - why should criticizing islam or not catering to its rules and morals should be racist then?

Actually, the SdF only served pork soup to the homeless rather than providing an alternative to those who could not eat pork on religious grounds, and whose director claims that other charities can support homeless Muslims and Jews. Restaurants are safe because: (a) they offer alternatives to pork, (b) pork dishes are marked on a menu, and (c) Halal meat has come under EU fire for its treatment of animals.

Since I have read this articel, I have been wondering what will happen next. Technically, Muslims and Jews ( whilst the latter however is rather unlikely) would be able to sue any restaurant serving pork meat which they like. As buccaneer pointed out, if pork meat offered as present to the needy has already been prohibited, the step towards banning it in general is not far. For there presuambly are only little homeless Muslims. Might these individuals want to dinner in restaurants where pork meat is served, then a problem arises. If a neighbouring customers now orders it ( along with alcool, oh my god !!), Muslims could argue it is incriminating and hurting their religious feelings.The conformation of certain, daily habits (e.g. the sort of food we eat, the things we drink) to Muslims' standards is an important step in the direction of an Islamic Eu-Arabia, as favoured by sozialists and multi-culturalists alike.

The courts are more concerned with angry reactions than public order.
 
In other news, pigs are now boycotting the eating of humans, forcing organised crime to become a bit more inventive than relying on pig farmers...

Insanity.

Liberalism is a mental disorder.

This is quite an interesting evolution.
I used to visit kebab restaurants and alikes very often in the past, but recently I became a member of the church of FSM (www.vengenza.org). This means I am not allowed to eat any meat except pork. (I am not an FMS fundi, I eat other dishes apart from spaghetti Bolognaise).
Seen the recent developments in France, I take it that restaurants which do not serve any pork meat can be regarded as racist?
Since I live in Belgium, safely guarded by an institution called "CGKR" (freely translated as: "centre against discrimination and racism") could it be possible that I take this French court ruling as an example to claim some compensation from these racist restaurants?
Or could it be that it is only a racist act not to serve pork when it is offered FREE?
 
 

"The court said distributing pork soup threatens public order because it could spark angry reactions."
Angry reactions eh? I wonder whose angry reactions those might be? It certainly won't be the Jewish population, so that leaves only one group. It's amazing how far Europe is moving towards some sort of new age communism. I mean come on. This is a private charity.

Hmm... I wonder why the French suddenly are so preoccupied about their Jewish citizens. Maybe because it's a good pretext to cater once more to Muslim sensitivities without having to directly admit it? I mean, noone is forced to accept gifts, as the soup is for free and obviously noone cheats about what's in it. So who's it who cries - hey, if I take a present from you you better gotta give me something I like or I sue you!. I doubt that it's been Jews complaining about that soup..
Yet it's also very interesting to hear that French judges seem to base their judgement not only on multicultural arguments but also on the fear of public order being threatened.
Fear of angry reactions. From whom? Possibly their Jewish citizens???
Fear as a source of the legal process, threats as its inspiration.
At least the islamists will start feeling at home in the French legal system, reeling of joy.
But we shouldn't be worried about them, after all they are a tiny minority and
the vast majority of Muslims is moderate, at least in Britain:
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014730.php#comments